Oppo Politics: shutdown mania

"mkbruin, Atlas VP" (mkbruin) 01/19/2018 at 12:37 • Filed to: None

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After the jump.

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“Hostage-taking” is the term that was used in 2013 when Ted Cruz and a few other Republicans blocked government funding to try to force repeal of ObamaCare. You can’t deny people essential government services just because you didn’t get your way on some other policy! Now here we are, five years later, and Democrats are prepared to deny those same services because they haven’t gotten their way on a DREAM amnesty with essentially no strings attached.

Let’s run through this again because job one for Schumer and Pelosi over the next 24 hours will be to muddy waters that are actually quite clear.

First offer from Republicans: Let’s fund the government and pass a DREAM amnesty, as both sides want to do , and in return you give us some concessions on chain migration and the wall. Republicans have no choice but to use DREAM as leverage for those concessions despite their support for the policy because Democrats are incredibly reluctant to tighten admission policies under the best of circumstances. So how about a little something in return for DREAM, in the name of compromise? Nope, says Schumer. Won’t do it. We’ll give you a few billion in mad money for border improvements but we’re not doing anything that might move the U.S. towards skills-based criteria for immigrants and away from “bring the whole family!” policies.

Second offer from Republicans: Okay, since we’re stuck on a DREAM deal, let’s table the whole immigration issue for now and instead agree to fund the government and extend CHIP long-term, as both sides want to do . We’ll come back to DREAM afterwards when we’re not facing a hard deadline. Nope, says Schumer. Won’t do it. The amnesty fanatics in my base refuse to let us sign on to any funding deal that doesn’t include DREAM. Even though not only is DACA still in effect, the feds are !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! .

Third offer from Republicans: Okay, since Democrats are hung up on amnesty and worried about voting for a bill that doesn’t include it, let’s temporarily change the rules so that they don’t have to vote for the bill at all. Last night McConnell asked for unanimous consent from the Senate to let Republicans pass a funding bill with 50 votes instead of the 60 that the filibuster requires. It’s not at all certain that he has even 50 votes right now, but he was willing to take full responsibility for the bill’s passage via his caucus alone. If he found the votes he needed, the government would stay open without any Democratic assent to the DREAM-less bill. Nope, said Schumer. Won’t do it. He !!!error: Indecipherable SUB-paragraph formatting!!! McConnell still needs 60, all but ensuring a shutdown.

The basic problem with the current funding standoff is the same basic problem in all negotiations that touch on immigration: Democrats are simply too radical on the issue to agree to meaningful compromise. In that one sense, immigration politics reminds me of abortion politics. There too Republicans are knocked as radicals and absolutists when in reality Democrats are at least as extreme in their own beliefs. Heavy majorities of the public agree that abortion should be banned after 20 weeks yet it’s basic dogma among most Democratic pols — certainly ones with national ambitions — that abortion should be completely unrestricted, essentially up to the moment of birth. Even Doug Jones, running for a Senate seat in a red state in the deep south, wouldn’t move off that position. That’s fanaticism.

So it is with immigration, where Democrats routinely resist attempts to put real teeth into enforcement (e.g., E-Verify) or to limit far-reaching family reunification policies for legal immigrants, even if Republicans are willing to agree to amnesty in the process . The “absolutist” GOP, led by its “nativist” president, is openly declaring its willingness to rubber-stamp DREAM. They just want a down payment on real controls over new immigration. Democrats won’t do it because, demographics being what they are, they’ve increasingly adopted a fanatic stance on open borders for their own political gain. It really is as simple as that.

My bird IS the word > mkbruin, Atlas VP 01/19/2018 at 12:49

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Democrats and Republicans: the same shit in different flavors.

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > My bird IS the word 01/19/2018 at 12:51

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And I think some of it is more solid and chunky and some of it is runnier. There is a lack of consistency .

jimz > mkbruin, Atlas VP 01/19/2018 at 12:52

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IOKIYAR, I guess.

Nothing > mkbruin, Atlas VP 01/19/2018 at 12:56

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You also make it sound like everything offered in avoidance to a government shutdown is done in good faith, when rarely in politics, is anything done in such a manner. And in 5 years, 10 years, whatever years, the tables will be turned and it’ll be same shit, different day.

It’s funny, because if more people paid attention, politics as usual plays out in the local jurisdictions, too. City councils, your state reps, it’s all great lip service until that money starts lining your pockets.

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > mkbruin, Atlas VP 01/19/2018 at 12:58

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Where does 45's sh!thole sh!tshow fit into your timeline? You haven’t mentioned it. Or his tweet that CHIP shouldn’t be included? Or his plan to jet off — AGAIN — at taxpayer expense for a weekend of golf while the shutdown looms? And what deep state bloated government functions that are “essential” won’t continue to operate? Like the War Department all stays at home until the pols quit squabbling? Doubtful.

You’re not going to bring any Liberals on board without acknowledging that 45 has done zero to aid either side on this because of his bomb throwing.

OpposResidentLexusGuy - USE20, XF20, XU30 and Press Cars > mkbruin, Atlas VP 01/19/2018 at 12:58

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Still one of the best gifs ever.

My bird IS the word > Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo 01/19/2018 at 13:01

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All I know is that it causes sickness if you forget to wash your hands of it.

Milky > mkbruin, Atlas VP 01/19/2018 at 13:02

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Lol, how small of a mention this gets.

and in return you give us some concessions on chain migration and the wall.

Trump killed dreamers and Trump wants a real wall, let him deal with it.

HammerheadFistpunch > mkbruin, Atlas VP 01/19/2018 at 13:04

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Politics in my life time remind me of one of the stupidest and most hated part of car culture that I’ve essentially learned to ignore as being isolated to the worst subsets of the scene: Die hard brand loyalists.

Cheby vs Ferd Vs Rammit

Toyota vs Jeep

Mitsubishi vs Subaru

Etc.

Its stupid. Fine, have a preference, but don’t get all red in the face when a Toyota rolls up to a Jeep party. The smart, and seasoned car pros have respect for other brands and their owners even if they don’t fully understand them. Gahbage!

At this point I know how to bypass fanboism in cars because non-toxic cultures abound, you just have to align yourself with one. The most depressing part about high stakes politics is that I don’t have confidence there is an equivalent choice; The culture is ONLY accepting of douchebag party loyalists.

Super depressing.

EL_ULY > mkbruin, Atlas VP 01/19/2018 at 13:06

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Either way, regular Corn Flakes with a couple spoons of sugar is far superior to Frosted Flakes.

100% tru fax confirmed by God and NASA

Rusty Vandura - www.tinyurl.com/keepoppo > My bird IS the word 01/19/2018 at 13:11

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More to the point: if you eat it.

fintail > mkbruin, Atlas VP 01/19/2018 at 13:14

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The party dependent on gerrymandering complains about others benefiting via demographics. Now that’s hypocrisy.

It’s also mystifying how anything from this regime, the worst in history, can be considered “in good faith”. No doubt many rightist businessowners dependent on cheap easily exploitable labor aren’t fans of verification systems either. And taxing these types is theft, lawl.

Definitely, Rs and Ds can be equally extreme. The question is: which extremism is more destructive? 

Funny terms, too - Skills-based criteria being preached by this regime: like lying about architecture studies and being a model? Or buying your way in with 500K to launder ill-gotten gains in real estate? Not to mention, conman’s son of a conman son in law (who is hawking the buy your way in model) works against any ideal of meritocracy.

Mercedes Streeter > mkbruin, Atlas VP 01/19/2018 at 13:17

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Since it’s now legal to deny healthcare service to me because of “religious hangups”, fuck the GOP. Somehow, DACA recipients are in even worse shape than I am. It’s not like it was their choice to come to this country, now we plan on giving them the boot.

Show me one fucking line in the Bible that says a true Christian should not help their fellow sinner. We’re all sinners in the eyes of God, there’s no need to take a fucking high road like that will save you. The Bible teaches love, not hate...flat out.

(This unnecessarily vulgar rant brought to you by how interesting it will be for me to get my necessary surgeries this year.)

Textured Soy Protein > mkbruin, Atlas VP 01/19/2018 at 13:34

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This will be the first time in history that the government has shut down when one party controls both congress and the presidency. The GOP has continually passed short-term continuing resolutions that only fund the government for a few months at a time. They’re the ones in control and yet they can’t agree among themselves on a full budget.

There are many democrats and even a few republicans in the senate who have stated that they are unwilling to pass yet another continuing resolution and instead want a full budget. Not because of DACA, or anything else. They don’t want another CR.

Democrats aren’t the only ones opposing passing another short-term continuing resolution. Here’s what Lindsay Graham had to say about continuing resolutions:

“There’s four of them. Eventually you’ve got to say no. I don’t want to shut the government down, but you know it’s killing the military.”

As for DACA ...

Sens. Dick Durbin, D-Illinois, and Lindsey Graham, R-South Carolina , introduced their bill Wednesday afternoon with Sens. Bob Menendez, D-New Jersey, Michael Bennet, D-Colorado, Jeff Flake, R-Arizona, Cory Gardner, R-Colorado, Lisa Murkowski, R-Alaska, Lamar Alexander, R-Tennessee, Susan Collins, R-Maine, and Mike Rounds, R-South Dakota , putting the bill close to having enough votes to pass the Senate, assuming unanimous Democratic support, but not quite to the 60-vote threshold needed to advance legislation.

The bill appeared to be the same that was presented to President Donald Trump last week, when the President, using vulgar terms, rejected the pitch, according to sources familiar with that meeting.

If passed, the bill would appropriate $2.705 billion in border security improvements, eliminate the visa lottery, make permanent the Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals program — offering a pathway to citizenship to those who qualify — and limit “chain migration,” or family-based migration, of the individuals eligible for the program.

But ok, sure, this is a democrat-only DACA bill that doesn’t do any of the things it actually does, and the democrats are the only ones who are voting no on the continuing resolutions. Right.

someassemblyrequired > mkbruin, Atlas VP 01/19/2018 at 13:36

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This would all go away if failure to pass a budget resulted in an immediate election within a few weeks, like in the UK and Canada. If you hold all the levers of government, and can’t get legislation passed, that’s on you, and the public should have an immediate opportunity to elect a government that will pass a budget.

jimz > Mercedes Streeter 01/19/2018 at 14:02

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for the most part, “Christianity” is just a thin veneer people apply to themselves to try and hide the ugliness beneath. like the guy I worked with a few jobs ago who was (literally) a Southern Baptist preacher. loved to go around talking about what a good Christian he was, and how he was “saved,” and so on, but I overheard him saying some nasty shit under his breath nearly every time he had a disagreement with someone else. then “I shouldn’t say that, I’m a Christian” as though that somehow un-does it.

nothing but a pathetic load of fucking hypocrites.

Future next gen S2000 owner > mkbruin, Atlas VP 01/19/2018 at 14:13

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I’m looking forward to a paid vacation next week. Those clown will shut it all down because they are children, I’ll come in and be told to go home, when the dust settles and they fire up the government I’ll get a paycheck for the time I was away.

Weather will be crazy next week. Maybe I’ll go skiing or take the motorcycle out.

nermal > mkbruin, Atlas VP 01/19/2018 at 15:29

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Everybody is acting childish and throwing temper tantrums, as is traditional.

The reason that the Ds are taking such a hard stance on amnesty for illegal child immigrants is because they want their votes for future elections. It’s a good long term strategy. It’s also the same reason why they don’t want The Wall, because that will cut down on future generations of illegal immigrants with cute marketing names - Instead of “dreamers”, what will the next ones be called?

What is granting amnesty going to do to deter future illegal immigrants? If anything it will have the opposite effect. Granting amnesty is sending the message that it’s ok to sneak across the border (or get a visa and over-stay it), and bring your kids too. I can see this also increasing business for coyotes, which isn’t good for anybody.

I can’t wait for the mudslinging campaigns around the midterm elections. On one side we’ll have a crying immigrant child with a message “They wanted to deport me :-(“, on the other a blue collar guy with a construction hat and the message “They gave my job to an illegal immigrant :-(“.

William Byrd > someassemblyrequired 01/19/2018 at 15:30

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You mean do your job or get fired? Like it is in most professions? That would be fantastic!

Bman76 (hates WS6 hoods, is on his phone and has 4 burners now) > mkbruin, Atlas VP 01/19/2018 at 15:53

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“Have no choice but to use the DREAMers as leverage” umm yes they do, if both sides support it then you could pass it with no strings attached.

This is the problem with government in general, we should just pass the stuff everyone agrees on and fight about the other stuff later. Not poison and/or pork belly every single bill into oblivion.

Dr. Zoidberg - RIP Oppo > EL_ULY 01/19/2018 at 16:50

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Prepare to question everything you’ve ever believed in:

CINNIMON Frosted Flakes.

someassemblyrequired > William Byrd 01/19/2018 at 17:07

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The parliamentary system isn’t perfect, but it has its advantages...

His Stigness > Mercedes Streeter 01/19/2018 at 17:31

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I heard that story on NPR about nurses crying over having to provide essential services to those they don’t like. It’s fucking sickening and I can’t believe this kind of shit will be allowed.

Mercedes Streeter > His Stigness 01/19/2018 at 18:11

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A girl I went on a date with three weeks ago is a Nurse and is trans. She has had to deal with transphobes, Nazis, murderers, pedophiles, the works. But you know what? She knows that’s the job she signed up for. She knows she signed up for a job in which she’d have to take care of people who hate her very existence. She doesn’t cry, she doesn’t get mad, she just does her job.

Seriously, if you’re that “triggered” by the chance you may have to help a Democrat/Republican, a trans person, a gay person, etc. then you shouldn’t be in that line of work. Or sure, you can say no all you want, but don’t be surprised when/if your employer lets you go for not doing your job. I thought the GOP was all about the free market?

His Stigness > Mercedes Streeter 01/19/2018 at 18:19

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That’s what I don’t get either. What did these nurses expect to do when they signed up? And are we really to believe for the whole time they’ve been a nurse they haven’t had a “triggering event” until now, or is it more likely there’s a racist/homophobic/piece of shit in the white house who they think feels the same as them?